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	<title>Comments on: Too Hot for TV!  BANNED from ProductCamp!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/</link>
	<description>Building Product Management from the Ground Up by Paul Young</description>
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		<title>By: Hibernating an Idea &#124; Product Beautiful: Building Product Management by Paul Young</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1971</link>
		<dc:creator>Hibernating an Idea &#124; Product Beautiful: Building Product Management by Paul Young</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Nov 2010 04:25:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1971</guid>
		<description>[...] going through revisions and ultimately unveiling it at ProductCamp Austin.  That created some controversy, but ended up for the best.  The idea had some traction and a couple hundred people got online and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] going through revisions and ultimately unveiling it at ProductCamp Austin.  That created some controversy, but ended up for the best.  The idea had some traction and a couple hundred people got online and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Cranky Product Manager</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1911</link>
		<dc:creator>The Cranky Product Manager</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jun 2010 20:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1911</guid>
		<description>The Cranky PM is late responding to this (deliberate given her role in the recent Product Camp drama you alluded to), but she just wanted to say, in her usual ALL-CAPS method of &quot;speaking&quot; - YOU&#039;RE BEING SILLY!

Don&#039;t ban yourself.  That doesn&#039;t help anyone. As a thought leader in the product management community, you help everyone when you present and share what you know about the profession.  Your blog is one of the top ones in our space, and you have an obligation to share what you know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Cranky PM is late responding to this (deliberate given her role in the recent Product Camp drama you alluded to), but she just wanted to say, in her usual ALL-CAPS method of &#8220;speaking&#8221; &#8211; YOU&#8217;RE BEING SILLY!</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t ban yourself.  That doesn&#8217;t help anyone. As a thought leader in the product management community, you help everyone when you present and share what you know about the profession.  Your blog is one of the top ones in our space, and you have an obligation to share what you know.</p>
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		<title>By: Saeed Khan</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1896</link>
		<dc:creator>Saeed Khan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Apr 2010 20:00:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1896</guid>
		<description>Paul

Would it be possible to share the iphone app with other ProductCamp organizers? We&#039;re holding our next event at the end of May and having a similar app for our event would be great.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul</p>
<p>Would it be possible to share the iphone app with other ProductCamp organizers? We&#8217;re holding our next event at the end of May and having a similar app for our event would be great.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Sehlhorst</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1895</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Sehlhorst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Apr 2010 03:31:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1895</guid>
		<description>@Anne - I told Paul this after the session, and I hope you don&#039;t mind me saying it here too.  I think it was awesome that you stood up and expressed your feelings!

I support Paul in having given his &quot;pitch&quot; (I&#039;m in both groups 2 &amp; 3), and I also support you in calling him out on it.  I also will support/tolerate Paul not giving a presentation for a while.  I&#039;m thrilled with the discussion that&#039;s happening now - certain to make future product camps better.

Thanks to everyone who organizes, presents, and attends the product camps!  Since I&#039;m (temporarily) travelling full time, they are the number 1 way I can stay tapped into &quot;my&quot; community back home in Austin.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/sehlhorst&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@sehlhorst on Twitter&lt;/a&gt; - my #2 way to stay connected with all of you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Anne &#8211; I told Paul this after the session, and I hope you don&#8217;t mind me saying it here too.  I think it was awesome that you stood up and expressed your feelings!</p>
<p>I support Paul in having given his &#8220;pitch&#8221; (I&#8217;m in both groups 2 &amp; 3), and I also support you in calling him out on it.  I also will support/tolerate Paul not giving a presentation for a while.  I&#8217;m thrilled with the discussion that&#8217;s happening now &#8211; certain to make future product camps better.</p>
<p>Thanks to everyone who organizes, presents, and attends the product camps!  Since I&#8217;m (temporarily) travelling full time, they are the number 1 way I can stay tapped into &#8220;my&#8221; community back home in Austin.</p>
<p><a href="http://twitter.com/sehlhorst" rel="nofollow">@sehlhorst on Twitter</a> &#8211; my #2 way to stay connected with all of you.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Terry Walhus</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1894</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Terry Walhus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Apr 2010 18:52:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1894</guid>
		<description>The punishment is not nearly severe enough, Paul.  I think at the next ProductCamp in August we should brainstorm and vote on a suitable punishment so that you can really suffer for your transgression.  Perhaps an actual shark tank stocked with hungry fish.  Or maybe walking across hot coals in front of everyone at ProductCamp.   A pie throwing free for all?  A dunking tank? I think a good punishment could be arrived at in much the way sessions are voted on at the ProductCamp.  If you acheive your goal of &quot;crushing Silicon Valleys Product Camp&quot; by setting new attendance highs in August, it would enhance to number of onlookers to your public humiliation.

The collective mind at ProductCamp can surely come up with a more creative and imaginative punishment than any of these that I have suggested.  I have some more thoughts on what people learned at ProductCamp in an article I just submitted to the http://examiner.com/austin 

http://www.examiner.com/x-44059-Austin-Web-Development-Examiner~y2010m4d13-What-did-you-learn-at-Austin-ProductCamp</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The punishment is not nearly severe enough, Paul.  I think at the next ProductCamp in August we should brainstorm and vote on a suitable punishment so that you can really suffer for your transgression.  Perhaps an actual shark tank stocked with hungry fish.  Or maybe walking across hot coals in front of everyone at ProductCamp.   A pie throwing free for all?  A dunking tank? I think a good punishment could be arrived at in much the way sessions are voted on at the ProductCamp.  If you acheive your goal of &#8220;crushing Silicon Valleys Product Camp&#8221; by setting new attendance highs in August, it would enhance to number of onlookers to your public humiliation.</p>
<p>The collective mind at ProductCamp can surely come up with a more creative and imaginative punishment than any of these that I have suggested.  I have some more thoughts on what people learned at ProductCamp in an article I just submitted to the <a href="http://examiner.com/austin" rel="nofollow">http://examiner.com/austin</a> </p>
<p><a href="http://www.examiner.com/x-44059-Austin-Web-Development-Examiner~y2010m4d13-What-did-you-learn-at-Austin-ProductCamp" rel="nofollow">http://www.examiner.com/x-44059-Austin-Web-Development-Examiner~y2010m4d13-What-did-you-learn-at-Austin-ProductCamp</a></p>
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		<title>By: Product Camp Austin Recap &#124; A Random Jog</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1893</link>
		<dc:creator>Product Camp Austin Recap &#124; A Random Jog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Apr 2010 00:57:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1893</guid>
		<description>[...] Paul Young&#8217;s session on his new project Le.Af, please visit his blog and let him know your thoughts.  Paul is one of the strongest product managers I know and a great guy that has been instrumental [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Paul Young&#8217;s session on his new project Le.Af, please visit his blog and let him know your thoughts.  Paul is one of the strongest product managers I know and a great guy that has been instrumental [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Anne Moon</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1892</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne Moon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:41:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1892</guid>
		<description>Hi Paul,

I&#039;m the one who made the comment during your session.  Though I understood where you were going with the discussion, I felt strongly that I needed to speak up.  I did struggle with deciding if I should wait and tell you in person. I hope I made the best decision.  

Integrity is important for any business to be sustainable, so it&#039;s a lesson for each one of us to walk our talk,  and in the process we discover new things about ourselves.  

I do want to say that I think you are being too hard on yourself.  Life should be fun!  If I can do anything to help, please let me know. 

(I didn&#039;t want to hurt your feelings that day, I just wanted you to follow what you told everyone that morning in keeping with the integrity of the conference.)

Love and Light,

Anne</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Paul,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m the one who made the comment during your session.  Though I understood where you were going with the discussion, I felt strongly that I needed to speak up.  I did struggle with deciding if I should wait and tell you in person. I hope I made the best decision.  </p>
<p>Integrity is important for any business to be sustainable, so it&#8217;s a lesson for each one of us to walk our talk,  and in the process we discover new things about ourselves.  </p>
<p>I do want to say that I think you are being too hard on yourself.  Life should be fun!  If I can do anything to help, please let me know. </p>
<p>(I didn&#8217;t want to hurt your feelings that day, I just wanted you to follow what you told everyone that morning in keeping with the integrity of the conference.)</p>
<p>Love and Light,</p>
<p>Anne</p>
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		<title>By: Larry McKeogh</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1891</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry McKeogh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Apr 2010 21:06:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1891</guid>
		<description>Paul, 
I was shocked when I read about the ban and couldn&#039;t understand from the tweet.  After reading the explanation I agree with your decision.  As a  leader in the community you cast a big shadow.  For that reason, leaders are held to a different standard.  By imposing and following through you are saying and demonstrating what is acceptable and not.  The clearer those lines are the easier it is for everyone to work within or outside them.

That said, I don&#039;t see that this &quot;ban&quot; should stop you from helping the ProductCamp efforts.  Of course you knew that by looking in the mirror and taking the action you did.  It is yet another example for others to live up to.

Thanks for the guidance!
Larry
@lmckeogh</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul,<br />
I was shocked when I read about the ban and couldn&#8217;t understand from the tweet.  After reading the explanation I agree with your decision.  As a  leader in the community you cast a big shadow.  For that reason, leaders are held to a different standard.  By imposing and following through you are saying and demonstrating what is acceptable and not.  The clearer those lines are the easier it is for everyone to work within or outside them.</p>
<p>That said, I don&#8217;t see that this &#8220;ban&#8221; should stop you from helping the ProductCamp efforts.  Of course you knew that by looking in the mirror and taking the action you did.  It is yet another example for others to live up to.</p>
<p>Thanks for the guidance!<br />
Larry<br />
@lmckeogh</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Boudreaux</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1890</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Boudreaux</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:53:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1890</guid>
		<description>Paul,

You took this much further than I would have, but I think that this is a good statement of your integrity and how much you value the concept of ProductCamp.  It is good to stick by the rules, and I think that it is an important rule that &quot;ProductCamp sessions are NOT for selling your product, your service, or you (e.g. consultants and recruiters).&quot;

I really enjoyed your session, and I thought it was a great opportunity to participate in a product launch up close - to see it first hand.  I do agree with you that it was a pitch, but it wasn&#039;t the kind of pitch that  made me feel taken advantage of or uncomfortable.  However, there was obviously at least one person in the room that as noticably affected by it.

The concept of the 2-foot rule is great, but if presenters bend the rules and start including product pitches along with excellent content then it makes it hard to exercise the 2-foot rule.  I would probably endure a 5-minute pitch if the rest of the content was really valuable.  However,  this detracts from the experience of ProductCamp overall and changes the spirit of the event.

Rather than hosting product launches at ProductCamp, which will inherently be a pitch, it seems like there are other alternatives that could work within the rules:
- a case study on how to launch a new product
- an interactive workshop to develop a launch plan
- a panel discussion about strategic choices that were made


Mike
@Mike Boudreaux</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul,</p>
<p>You took this much further than I would have, but I think that this is a good statement of your integrity and how much you value the concept of ProductCamp.  It is good to stick by the rules, and I think that it is an important rule that &#8220;ProductCamp sessions are NOT for selling your product, your service, or you (e.g. consultants and recruiters).&#8221;</p>
<p>I really enjoyed your session, and I thought it was a great opportunity to participate in a product launch up close &#8211; to see it first hand.  I do agree with you that it was a pitch, but it wasn&#8217;t the kind of pitch that  made me feel taken advantage of or uncomfortable.  However, there was obviously at least one person in the room that as noticably affected by it.</p>
<p>The concept of the 2-foot rule is great, but if presenters bend the rules and start including product pitches along with excellent content then it makes it hard to exercise the 2-foot rule.  I would probably endure a 5-minute pitch if the rest of the content was really valuable.  However,  this detracts from the experience of ProductCamp overall and changes the spirit of the event.</p>
<p>Rather than hosting product launches at ProductCamp, which will inherently be a pitch, it seems like there are other alternatives that could work within the rules:<br />
- a case study on how to launch a new product<br />
- an interactive workshop to develop a launch plan<br />
- a panel discussion about strategic choices that were made</p>
<p>Mike<br />
@Mike Boudreaux</p>
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		<title>By: NWGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.productbeautiful.com/2010/04/08/too-hot-for-tv-banned-from-productcamp/comment-page-1/#comment-1889</link>
		<dc:creator>NWGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:44:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.productbeautiful.com/?p=250#comment-1889</guid>
		<description>Paul,  

Don&#039;t be quite so harsh.  You should consider asking the offended person for a fair penalty.  One year of not presenting when people can vote with their feet sounds harsh.  Maybe you should have to go to 3 of the sessions that get the least votes to show support?  Austin does have nice enough weather for a dunk tank; each Camp could have 5 people voted to sit in the tank?  You get the first 3 slots ;)

Seriously, we owe you a lot for your support of PCA and Camps nationwide. Reconsider and make the punishment fit the crime.  It also provides you the credibility to enforce that type of punishment of anybody else that the community believes does a pitch versus presentation.

If you open up to pitches than you can get into the whole mess of sponsorships; how do you limit them; etc...  Maybe more than you want for such an already great event.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul,  </p>
<p>Don&#8217;t be quite so harsh.  You should consider asking the offended person for a fair penalty.  One year of not presenting when people can vote with their feet sounds harsh.  Maybe you should have to go to 3 of the sessions that get the least votes to show support?  Austin does have nice enough weather for a dunk tank; each Camp could have 5 people voted to sit in the tank?  You get the first 3 slots ;)</p>
<p>Seriously, we owe you a lot for your support of PCA and Camps nationwide. Reconsider and make the punishment fit the crime.  It also provides you the credibility to enforce that type of punishment of anybody else that the community believes does a pitch versus presentation.</p>
<p>If you open up to pitches than you can get into the whole mess of sponsorships; how do you limit them; etc&#8230;  Maybe more than you want for such an already great event.</p>
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